1 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:12,380 In 1998, the World Wrestling Federation enlisted 16 wrestlers in a radical 2 00:00:12,380 --> 00:00:16,960 experiment, an unscripted, legitimate, prize -fighting tournament. 3 00:00:17,220 --> 00:00:21,040 Let them fight for real, man. Put on gloves. Let them go out there. Let's 4 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:24,900 legitimately see who the toughest guy is. 5 00:00:26,620 --> 00:00:32,100 The brawl for all was probably the worst idea in the professional wrestling 6 00:00:32,100 --> 00:00:36,650 business. Wrestlers risk their bodies and their careers for a chance in the 7 00:00:36,650 --> 00:00:42,050 spotlight. For some, it would all come crashing down in the brawl for all. 8 00:00:42,310 --> 00:00:45,570 A lot of people did get hurt. I would f*** up. 9 00:00:47,270 --> 00:00:48,910 It was looking kind of sad. 10 00:00:49,130 --> 00:00:52,890 The guys were gassed and blowing up, and the crowd wasn't really getting with 11 00:00:52,890 --> 00:00:53,890 it. 12 00:00:54,890 --> 00:00:56,050 They got hurt. 13 00:00:56,470 --> 00:00:57,670 They got embarrassed. 14 00:00:58,710 --> 00:01:00,290 And they got their career short. 15 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:04,200 There's a train wreck. Come on. Watch it. Just watch. 16 00:01:04,700 --> 00:01:05,700 You'll see. 17 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:18,380 By the late 90s, wrestling had become a global phenomenon. 18 00:01:18,780 --> 00:01:23,760 Two companies were competing for dominance in a TV ratings war. As every 19 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:28,820 night, millions would tune in to watch WWF or WCW. 20 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:33,580 The battle was fought through an escalation of bold and provocative new 21 00:01:33,860 --> 00:01:35,460 Some still resonate today. 22 00:01:35,700 --> 00:01:37,240 Others are long forgotten. 23 00:01:37,460 --> 00:01:42,460 On this episode, we reveal the inside story of what's been called wrestling's 24 00:01:42,460 --> 00:01:44,100 worst idea ever. 25 00:01:46,730 --> 00:01:49,310 This is Vince Russo here for The Brand. 26 00:01:49,510 --> 00:01:53,670 We will talk about anything today but professional wrestling. Why? 27 00:01:53,870 --> 00:01:57,390 Because I hate wrestling, bro. I don't want to talk about wrestling. I'll talk 28 00:01:57,390 --> 00:01:59,530 about your mother, your grandmother, your grandfather. 29 00:01:59,910 --> 00:02:05,090 My name is Vince Russo. I was a head writer at WWF Magazine. 30 00:02:05,450 --> 00:02:10,770 Around the time when I started writing the magazine, like 95, 96, the product 31 00:02:10,770 --> 00:02:15,390 was horrible. There were characters at the time that were so bad. 32 00:02:16,190 --> 00:02:19,270 PL Hopper, The Goon, Mantar. 33 00:02:22,910 --> 00:02:25,750 I'm like, there's no way he's getting his head in the ring. 34 00:02:26,030 --> 00:02:28,330 And sure enough, he cannot get in the ring. 35 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:33,240 Times were changing, and the WWE kept going backwards. 36 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:38,200 With the Internet, the secret was out of the bag. People know this is fake. 37 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:43,960 What they really want to know is what kind of really goes on behind the 38 00:02:44,060 --> 00:02:45,580 That's where everything was moving. 39 00:02:47,700 --> 00:02:51,480 There's a lot of people that try to say it doesn't matter whether people know 40 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:53,740 that it's rigged. I don't like to use the word fake. 41 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:57,380 It does matter. Why don't you like to use the word fake? Because there's 42 00:02:57,380 --> 00:02:58,380 fake about it. 43 00:02:58,570 --> 00:03:02,590 It may be predetermined. It may be choreographed. It can be manipulated. 44 00:03:02,850 --> 00:03:06,650 But there's nothing fake about guys breaking their bodies down. I'm Jim 45 00:03:06,650 --> 00:03:11,750 Cornette. I've been a promoter, a matchmaker, manager, trainer, everything 46 00:03:11,750 --> 00:03:13,070 wrestling for the last 40 years. 47 00:03:14,770 --> 00:03:20,270 When I started working for the WWF at the time, Vince is in a circle. They 48 00:03:20,270 --> 00:03:24,530 lifers. They had been in the wrestling business forever, and I felt that they 49 00:03:24,530 --> 00:03:27,030 were looking at the wrestling business from within. 50 00:03:27,480 --> 00:03:28,740 I came as a fan. 51 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:34,220 Vince McMahon is somebody that is never going to be fully understood. He's a 52 00:03:34,220 --> 00:03:38,040 genius and a demon. Vince McMahon has no other hobbies. 53 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:42,600 I doubt very seriously if he's gone to the grocery store or been to a movie in 54 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:43,600 over 40 years. 55 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:46,720 But Vince McMahon has always been the WWF. 56 00:03:47,180 --> 00:03:49,800 I got a call from Vince's assistant. 57 00:03:50,490 --> 00:03:52,670 And she said, Vince wants to see you up here immediately. 58 00:03:52,970 --> 00:03:59,210 So I literally think I am going up to his office to be fired. Then as I walk 59 00:03:59,210 --> 00:04:05,090 his office, all the minions, Bruce Prichard, Jim Ross, Pat Patterson, Jim 60 00:04:05,090 --> 00:04:11,370 Cornette, and Vince has got the Raw magazine in his hand. And he slams it 61 00:04:11,370 --> 00:04:16,709 on the table and he says, this is what our television show needs to be. 62 00:04:16,930 --> 00:04:19,350 And from that point on, I... 63 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:21,440 became involved in the writing of the show. 64 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:25,920 Vince Russo brings an outsider's perspective to the secretive world of 65 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,820 matchmaking, and he isn't afraid to push his own vision of what wrestling could 66 00:04:29,820 --> 00:04:32,380 be. At first, I was like, okay, he's a goof. 67 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:36,400 He's never been involved in wrestling. He doesn't know how this stuff works. We 68 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:41,180 can try to explain it to him. And within a few months, I realized he didn't want 69 00:04:41,180 --> 00:04:45,760 to learn. He wanted to do wrestling the way he wanted to do it, which was the 70 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:46,760 Jerry Springer Show. 71 00:04:48,010 --> 00:04:50,810 The Jerry Springer show was the hottest thing on TV. 72 00:04:51,030 --> 00:04:56,410 We literally would sit there and write Monday Night Raw with the Springer show 73 00:04:56,410 --> 00:05:01,410 playing in the background. This approach would become the Attitude Era. 74 00:05:02,090 --> 00:05:07,030 You had angles where guys were stealing each other's wives or, you know, one guy 75 00:05:07,030 --> 00:05:11,230 stole the other guy's dog and cooked it and fed it to him. Back then, man, you 76 00:05:11,230 --> 00:05:18,010 had fraternities on college campuses gathering every Monday night to watch 77 00:05:18,010 --> 00:05:22,270 across the country. So, number one, you can't, you don't want to insult their 78 00:05:22,270 --> 00:05:25,290 intelligence because they'll never watch it again. And number two, you don't 79 00:05:25,290 --> 00:05:26,450 want to mamby -pamby it. 80 00:05:26,810 --> 00:05:29,970 That's what I was all about during the Attitude Era was. 81 00:05:30,270 --> 00:05:36,290 What was going to make a casual television viewer watch this product if 82 00:05:36,290 --> 00:05:37,350 weren't a wrestling fan? 83 00:05:37,910 --> 00:05:43,610 To maintain their edge, WWF needs a constant stream of original ideas, 84 00:05:43,610 --> 00:05:45,610 audiences have never seen before. 85 00:05:46,190 --> 00:05:47,510 Look, here's the deal, man. 86 00:05:47,750 --> 00:05:50,610 You've got to bring something to the old man. He's looking for an idea. 87 00:05:50,830 --> 00:05:51,910 What's the next big thing? 88 00:05:52,130 --> 00:05:53,029 I don't know. 89 00:05:53,030 --> 00:05:54,290 How about this? Okay. 90 00:05:55,090 --> 00:05:56,090 I'm Jim Ross. 91 00:05:56,590 --> 00:05:57,730 Gun wrestling in 1974. 92 00:05:58,130 --> 00:06:03,110 So my career has lasted for many generations as a broadcaster, as 93 00:06:03,350 --> 00:06:05,390 and executive vice president. 94 00:06:05,630 --> 00:06:07,090 The idea came from Vince Russo. 95 00:06:07,430 --> 00:06:09,230 So get inside his head. Hell, I don't know. 96 00:06:09,510 --> 00:06:16,350 The idea from the Brawl for All was really simple, okay? I was not a big fan 97 00:06:16,350 --> 00:06:18,070 of JBL. John Layfield. 98 00:06:18,290 --> 00:06:22,970 I was from New York. John was, you know, from Texas. I thought he had a big 99 00:06:22,970 --> 00:06:25,130 mouth. I thought he was full of himself. 100 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:27,320 I thought he was a bully. 101 00:06:27,860 --> 00:06:34,320 We were backstage at a show one day, and John Layfield made the comment that if 102 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:38,160 this were real, I would beat everybody's ass in the locker room. 103 00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:44,920 So now I'm sitting there, and I'm saying, you braggadocious bully bastard. 104 00:06:45,700 --> 00:06:50,040 I know of at least ten guys in this locker room that have kicked your ass. I 105 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:54,300 went to Vince McMahon, and I proposed the idea of a brawl for him. 106 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:58,080 And he goes, what do you mean? I said, Vince, we're becoming more and more and 107 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:02,280 more and more real. Let him fight for real, man. Put on gloves. Let him go out 108 00:07:02,280 --> 00:07:07,740 there. Let him fight. Let's legitimately see who the toughest guy is. 109 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:14,560 Vince gave the idea his blessing, and we went on with the brawl for all. 110 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:19,500 The top stars have nothing to gain risking their reputation in an 111 00:07:19,500 --> 00:07:22,940 fight. The challenge is to find 16 competitors. 112 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:24,600 with nothing to lose. 113 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:31,060 I got stabbed with a bottle, a wine bottle, in a bar fight. They broke a 114 00:07:31,060 --> 00:07:34,660 and stuck it in. When they stuck it in, they went in and up, punctured a lung, 115 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:38,260 lung collapsed, shredded the diaphragm and lacerated the liver. 116 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:42,680 Everybody knows me as Bart Gunn here in the States, part of the smoking guns. 117 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,560 Cowboy gimmick. We rode horse adapt. That was pretty cool. 118 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:48,680 Hey there, I'm Bart. And I'm Billy. 119 00:07:52,650 --> 00:07:56,970 For whatever reason, everybody that comes in as a tag team, eventually they 120 00:07:56,970 --> 00:07:57,970 split up. 121 00:07:58,210 --> 00:08:03,750 When Billy and I were split up, my career kind of, I don't want to say 122 00:08:03,770 --> 00:08:05,610 I guess it's good to say it fizzled out. 123 00:08:06,590 --> 00:08:10,070 I had a hard time adjusting to it, though. It was a little difficult. 124 00:08:12,570 --> 00:08:14,190 When I first approached, it was Bruce. 125 00:08:14,730 --> 00:08:18,470 He said, hey, we're going to do this brawl for all, kind of a tough man 126 00:08:18,970 --> 00:08:20,430 I go, how are you going to do that? 127 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:23,840 I said, no, I said, don't want to do it. I thought it was a stupid idea. 128 00:08:24,420 --> 00:08:28,060 And then Kevin Kelly, he said, this here would be great for your career. He 129 00:08:28,060 --> 00:08:31,100 says, you're kind of stuck right there at the middle, and you go through this, 130 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:33,640 and they say you'll have a great run with Austin because that's the winner of 131 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:35,400 the tournament. He's going to get a run with Steve Austin. 132 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:37,360 At the time, he was the hottest thing going. 133 00:08:37,700 --> 00:08:41,700 And then, of course, you work with the top, top guy, you get top, top pay. And 134 00:08:41,700 --> 00:08:44,740 thought about it, thought about it, and that's when I decided that I would go 135 00:08:44,740 --> 00:08:45,740 ahead and do it. 136 00:08:46,690 --> 00:08:51,970 The WWF approaches their toughest, most underutilized wrestlers with the lure of 137 00:08:51,970 --> 00:08:54,350 cash prizes and main event status. 138 00:08:55,330 --> 00:08:59,990 Well, there are a lot of tough guys in the locker room. I think when I looked 139 00:08:59,990 --> 00:09:05,490 this thing, I'm like, Godfather, like, was probably the toughest guy. 140 00:09:06,330 --> 00:09:10,170 Big 6 '7", 6 '8 guy, worked in bars, had been a bouncer. 141 00:09:10,530 --> 00:09:12,390 My real name is Charles Wright. 142 00:09:12,960 --> 00:09:19,740 I wrestled for many years in the WWF as everything from Papa Shango to Kama, 143 00:09:19,820 --> 00:09:24,820 joined the Nation of Domination with The Rock and that whole group, and then 144 00:09:24,820 --> 00:09:28,540 became my favorite person ever, The Godfather. 145 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:34,300 Selling white girls on TV, talking about getting high, and selling pussy. I'm in 146 00:09:34,300 --> 00:09:35,900 the Nation of Domination now. 147 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:37,840 They're building up Mark Henry. 148 00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:39,500 The Rocks take it over. 149 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:43,320 So now I'm like, I got to make a change. They're not doing nothing with me. 150 00:09:43,500 --> 00:09:47,900 Bruce Pritchard had called me and said, hey, we're doing this thing. You get, I 151 00:09:47,900 --> 00:09:51,560 think, $10 ,000 if you fight. There's so much more if you win. 152 00:09:51,840 --> 00:09:52,940 And you're wearing gloves. 153 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:56,960 And I'm like, hell yeah, I'll do it. That's the stuff I do anyway. So I was 154 00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:57,960 right from the beginning. 155 00:09:59,060 --> 00:10:02,120 Darren Drozdoff was one of my favorite recruits of all time. Came out of the 156 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:03,120 University of Maryland. 157 00:10:03,180 --> 00:10:04,280 He just wanted to compete. 158 00:10:04,810 --> 00:10:08,730 They brought me in as a football player to see if I could learn the sport. 159 00:10:09,090 --> 00:10:11,650 We saw footage of him puking on an NFL game. 160 00:10:11,910 --> 00:10:13,230 I threw up all the time. 161 00:10:13,470 --> 00:10:16,550 If I was throwing up at that time, if I could grab ahold of you, you'd get one 162 00:10:16,550 --> 00:10:17,469 in the face. 163 00:10:17,470 --> 00:10:20,610 I brought him to the WWE offices to have a meeting with Vince McMahon. 164 00:10:21,370 --> 00:10:24,470 Vince loves that kind of humor. If you're a writer and you can come up with 165 00:10:24,470 --> 00:10:29,170 skit that involves puking, taking a dump, peeing, you'll probably buy it. 166 00:10:29,650 --> 00:10:33,430 He's got to puke! He's got to puke! He's got to puke! 167 00:10:34,959 --> 00:10:38,900 Whatever it takes. I thought, we'll do it this way. I'll come in as puke. 168 00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:43,140 I got my foot in the door or whatever, and I just went from there. 169 00:10:44,060 --> 00:10:49,660 Russo's idea is gaining traction, but not everyone in the WWF is convinced 170 00:10:49,660 --> 00:10:54,520 work. I first heard about the Brawl for All, I believe, at one of the TV tapings 171 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:58,100 when they were mentioning it was going to be starting in the next few weeks. 172 00:10:58,100 --> 00:11:03,280 as I grasped what they were talking about, I got more and more concerned 173 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,680 it. You don't know it's not going to work until you try it. I didn't kill the 174 00:11:06,680 --> 00:11:10,680 idea in my mind's eye when I first heard it. There was no precedent for it. 175 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:13,600 And you're taking guys out of their element and putting them into their 176 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:16,880 imaginary element of what they pretend they know, and that's bar fighting. 177 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:19,720 When I come up here, I've never been to bar fighting. Now the wrestlers are 178 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:22,360 living out their fantasies, and the result is chaos. 179 00:11:27,980 --> 00:11:32,440 With the unusual concept of combining professional wrestling, and real 180 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:36,120 the architects of the Brawl for All make final preparations. 181 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:40,240 They went around to all the talent and asked who wanted to participate. 182 00:11:40,580 --> 00:11:45,760 The story was, and I didn't see this hat, but the story was that the pairings 183 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:48,360 were chosen at random by drawing names out of a hat. 184 00:11:48,810 --> 00:11:52,490 What we did, and we did it in my office, had Savio Vega. 185 00:11:52,710 --> 00:11:57,070 We had a brown paper bag. I wrote everyone's name down on a piece of 186 00:11:57,170 --> 00:12:02,350 threw it in the bag, and Savio drew the names. And the first name drawn was the 187 00:12:02,350 --> 00:12:05,870 first name on the bracket and so on and so forth. So that's how the brackets 188 00:12:05,870 --> 00:12:07,670 were made. As the brackets are set. 189 00:12:08,030 --> 00:12:12,010 These 16 men become the official competitors in wrestling's first ever 190 00:12:12,010 --> 00:12:16,850 legitimate prize fighting tournament. You knew Steve Blackman was like the 191 00:12:16,850 --> 00:12:22,350 deal. Then you had a guy like Mark Merrow, who was a legitimate gold gloves 192 00:12:22,350 --> 00:12:27,830 champion. Mark Cannonberry, 6 '5", 300, punches like a bull. 193 00:12:28,130 --> 00:12:32,410 John Layfield Bradshaw, he's a big old rough and tough Texan. 194 00:12:32,620 --> 00:12:35,840 Baracus was a bodybuilder. He didn't have the mobility. 195 00:12:36,220 --> 00:12:39,320 Baracus had about as much business in the brawl for all as I would. 196 00:12:40,060 --> 00:12:44,620 Savio Vega always had like a little bit of a belly, but could take care of 197 00:12:44,620 --> 00:12:48,340 himself. Hogg would have no problem pulling a guy's eyeball out and eating 198 00:12:48,340 --> 00:12:49,600 biting his nose off his face. 199 00:12:49,860 --> 00:12:51,980 Bart Gunn was hardworking, dependable, loyal. 200 00:12:52,300 --> 00:12:53,320 You could rely on him. 201 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,420 Droz was a no -fear kind of guy. 202 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:01,940 Bob Holly was a badass on a street level. Carl Ouellette, big -time 203 00:13:01,940 --> 00:13:05,620 kid. Godfather, he beat up people like for a living. 204 00:13:05,820 --> 00:13:09,580 Dan Severin was a UFC Hall of Famer, a Super Fight Champion, a Triple Crown 205 00:13:09,580 --> 00:13:14,120 winner. Ron Harris walked into bars for one reason, and that was to fight. 206 00:13:14,380 --> 00:13:18,820 Too Cold Scorpio had decided he would try and break out of the Flash Funk ha 207 00:13:18,820 --> 00:13:19,820 gimmick. 208 00:13:21,060 --> 00:13:27,740 The one man that stands out is recent WWF acquisition Steve Williams, also 209 00:13:27,740 --> 00:13:29,040 to fans as Dr. 210 00:13:29,260 --> 00:13:30,260 Death. 211 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:34,040 He's like a little brother. We brought him out of college, gave him his first 212 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:38,840 job. Introducing first in the red corner, from the University of Oklahoma, 213 00:13:39,180 --> 00:13:40,500 Steve, Dr. 214 00:13:40,700 --> 00:13:41,699 F. Williams. 215 00:13:41,700 --> 00:13:44,900 He was a homegrown, sentimental favorite. 216 00:13:45,220 --> 00:13:48,740 I think he was four -time All -American football, and I believe he's a four 217 00:13:48,740 --> 00:13:51,180 -time All -American wrestler, too. Comes kind of busy. 218 00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:54,320 Does this face look like he's ever been scared? 219 00:13:54,740 --> 00:13:55,760 Jim Ross' boy. 220 00:13:56,060 --> 00:13:58,480 A lot of heat for that, saying that, but he's Jim Ross' boy. 221 00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:02,920 You hear about the boy from Japan, he beats the Japanese up, drop them on 222 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:03,920 head. 223 00:14:05,860 --> 00:14:10,820 The reason we're bringing Dr. Death into WWE was to eventually have a run with 224 00:14:10,820 --> 00:14:11,719 Stone Cold. 225 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:15,340 So we thought if this works out and Doc can pull his way through this 226 00:14:15,340 --> 00:14:18,560 tournament, we might have him ready to have a program with Austin. 227 00:14:19,630 --> 00:14:26,210 These guys for years and years go out there and they have a choreographed 228 00:14:26,330 --> 00:14:31,910 You know at some point in the locker room like these conversations really had 229 00:14:31,910 --> 00:14:37,550 come up. Like how bad an ass is Steve Blackman? Now it was real. Now a lot of 230 00:14:37,550 --> 00:14:40,330 these questions were going to be answered. 231 00:14:41,630 --> 00:14:43,510 Scheduled over a two -month period. 232 00:14:44,030 --> 00:14:49,510 The Brawl for All premieres June 29, 1998 on Monday Night Raw. Each match 233 00:14:49,510 --> 00:14:53,790 consists of three one -minute rounds with five points awarded for each landed 234 00:14:53,790 --> 00:14:59,830 punch and each takedown. The last man standing will receive a $75 ,000 cash 235 00:14:59,830 --> 00:15:00,830 prize. 236 00:15:02,110 --> 00:15:05,950 We are watching the Brawl for All for the first time in over 20 years. 237 00:15:06,330 --> 00:15:08,790 Look, look, look, look, look, look at this. Here, look, look. 238 00:15:09,250 --> 00:15:10,250 See? 239 00:15:11,219 --> 00:15:15,860 Oh, this is great, man, catching up. God, I was 28 years old, and I'm 50 now. 240 00:15:16,660 --> 00:15:22,120 Maybe two, three, four hours before the match, getting ready to fight a UFC 241 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:23,120 fighter. 242 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:28,220 Well, me, I was outside with some of the girls smoking cannabis. 243 00:15:28,780 --> 00:15:32,600 And that just goes to show you, one, that I was always smoking cannabis. 244 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:34,720 not the big deal. It's I had no fear. 245 00:15:36,189 --> 00:15:39,510 Anybody who knows anything can tell right off the bat these guys do not know 246 00:15:39,510 --> 00:15:40,970 to box, and it's just sloppy. 247 00:15:41,190 --> 00:15:44,690 You've gotten away from all your moves and all your setup. 248 00:15:45,010 --> 00:15:46,530 It has nothing to do with wrestling. 249 00:15:47,230 --> 00:15:51,210 Jim Ross had to try to explain to the fans why these guys may be great 250 00:15:51,210 --> 00:15:53,970 wrestlers, but they look like two drunks in a bar right now. 251 00:15:54,310 --> 00:15:56,310 It's not just the fans who are frustrated. 252 00:15:56,590 --> 00:16:00,050 The chaos of the fights makes them difficult for anyone to follow. 253 00:16:00,940 --> 00:16:04,860 I was so confused when everybody got signed up and the rules kept evolving 254 00:16:04,860 --> 00:16:05,860 takedown is legal. 255 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:10,480 I don't know if that's a takedown or a knockdown or... Is that a takedown? That 256 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:11,700 should be a takedown right there. 257 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:17,240 You've got a referee that's never refereed boxing or a competitive fight. 258 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:21,400 got judges that have never judged any type of competitive fight. When you've 259 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:25,520 stupidity on this grand biblical scale, anything is possible. 260 00:16:25,980 --> 00:16:32,720 I mean, again, I got to be honest with you. As a pure television viewer, I'm 261 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:34,380 totally entertained by this. 262 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:39,860 Dan Sever narrowly defeats the Godfather in the first round, but senses his 263 00:16:39,860 --> 00:16:43,320 reputation as a decorated fighter is at risk if he continues on. 264 00:16:44,420 --> 00:16:48,900 He decides to drop out of the tournament altogether, which sends the Godfather 265 00:16:48,900 --> 00:16:50,020 into round two. 266 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:54,140 Nobody knew what was going on, and that's when Guy started saying, let's 267 00:16:54,140 --> 00:16:55,140 punch each other. 268 00:16:55,690 --> 00:16:57,450 They get excited. Just throw punches. 269 00:16:58,470 --> 00:17:00,350 Somebody gets knocked out, they get knocked out. 270 00:17:00,570 --> 00:17:03,610 At the time, I was wrestling with Bob Holly. We were a tag team. We were 271 00:17:03,610 --> 00:17:04,610 actually Midnight Express. 272 00:17:04,849 --> 00:17:09,230 But my first bout and his, they put us against each other. 273 00:17:09,609 --> 00:17:12,450 I just thought that was a really shitty way of doing it. 274 00:17:12,730 --> 00:17:15,710 So yeah, we drew them. We drew them all out of the hat. It's just the way it 275 00:17:15,710 --> 00:17:16,529 came out. 276 00:17:16,530 --> 00:17:18,710 No, I'm not buying that one. 277 00:17:19,810 --> 00:17:23,730 As the reality of the situation takes hold, Brotherhood... 278 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:26,160 and professional relationships are put aside. 279 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:30,420 My friend, my partner, we're going to go out and whack each other. It started 280 00:17:30,420 --> 00:17:35,660 kind of weird. We traveled together. We shared a room. You know, we always ate 281 00:17:35,660 --> 00:17:36,660 together, go train together. 282 00:17:36,940 --> 00:17:38,760 Well, I got to hit him or he's going to hit me. 283 00:17:39,180 --> 00:17:42,840 I didn't go easy on him. I wanted to win. 284 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:47,460 Do you recall what it was like afterwards? 285 00:17:47,660 --> 00:17:50,340 Yeah, well, actually, we had to get in the car because we stayed in the same 286 00:17:50,340 --> 00:17:51,340 room that night. 287 00:17:51,590 --> 00:17:53,610 It was a little quiet, a little awkward. 288 00:17:54,530 --> 00:17:58,570 I think we might even have had a match or something the next day together, you 289 00:17:58,570 --> 00:17:59,570 know, as a tag team. 290 00:18:00,910 --> 00:18:04,210 Vince McMahon can't keep his finger out of anything. So even something that's 291 00:18:04,210 --> 00:18:07,590 supposed to be a legitimate shoot, he probably said to himself, as long as 292 00:18:07,590 --> 00:18:10,410 they're really fighting, we can play with the matchmaking all we want. 293 00:18:11,530 --> 00:18:16,090 People have talked about they've had the Dr. Death theory that this was skewed 294 00:18:16,090 --> 00:18:16,849 to Dr. 295 00:18:16,850 --> 00:18:20,250 Death, putting him in there with a one -eyed guy. No, it wasn't. 296 00:18:20,919 --> 00:18:24,880 Carl Ouellette had sight in one eye. Should have been a brawl for all hell 297 00:18:25,220 --> 00:18:26,220 What are we thinking? 298 00:18:26,380 --> 00:18:27,480 He's blind in one eye. 299 00:18:28,460 --> 00:18:30,280 I don't remember who the first injury was. 300 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:33,100 It was the first of several. One after the other. 301 00:18:33,700 --> 00:18:40,160 I tore my bicep and I tore my quads and tore my ACLs. It was like it was jinxed. 302 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:44,980 Vince could have pulled the plug on this any time he wanted to, but he chose not 303 00:18:44,980 --> 00:18:49,880 to. It didn't take but one week of TV to convince me that this... 304 00:18:50,140 --> 00:18:54,520 thing has shit the bed i dreaded having another night of brawl for all matches 305 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:58,140 because you never knew who's going to get hurt tonight because it seems to be 306 00:18:58,140 --> 00:19:03,640 inevitable and enough is enough the brawl for all tournament is already on 307 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:08,000 rocks but through the chaos an unlikely hero is set to emerge 308 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:14,920 when i was in the ninth grade 309 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:20,060 i weighed 89 pounds i was the shortest kid in class So I got picked on 310 00:19:20,060 --> 00:19:25,060 constantly. They slap you in the head, they push you, they trip you, knock your 311 00:19:25,060 --> 00:19:26,060 books out of your hands. 312 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:30,900 Then I got older, grew up, got a little bigger, and then I kind of went back, 313 00:19:30,900 --> 00:19:34,100 and everybody that kind of picked on me, I went back and paid them a visit, let 314 00:19:34,100 --> 00:19:35,100 them know what it was like. 315 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:40,960 After an awkward victory over his tag team partner in the first round of the 316 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:44,200 Brawl for All, Bart Gunn awaits his next opponent. 317 00:19:44,660 --> 00:19:47,000 Well, what happened was Bruce calls me up. 318 00:19:47,390 --> 00:19:50,390 He says, oh, Bart, just going to let you know we're going to be fighting Dr. 319 00:19:50,550 --> 00:19:52,190 Death. I go, really? 320 00:19:52,450 --> 00:19:55,030 He says, yeah. I said, oh, so you changed the brackets around. 321 00:19:55,330 --> 00:19:59,050 And I go, well, Bruce, why don't you guys leave it like it is and save us for 322 00:19:59,050 --> 00:20:02,290 the end? I said, you know, I'd be more than happy to work with you guys because 323 00:20:02,290 --> 00:20:04,070 everybody knows you guys want him to win. 324 00:20:04,270 --> 00:20:06,990 He goes, no, no, we got all the faith in the world in Dr. Death. 325 00:20:07,190 --> 00:20:09,030 That tells me right there it was designed for him. 326 00:20:09,350 --> 00:20:12,850 Absolutely. I already knew that because any time they actually advertised the 327 00:20:12,850 --> 00:20:14,830 brawl for all, they talked about Steve. 328 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:16,400 I said, okay. 329 00:20:16,460 --> 00:20:17,860 I said, well, let me ask you this. 330 00:20:18,220 --> 00:20:22,040 Am I going to get heat with you guys when I beat them? She goes, oh, no, no, 331 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:23,800 We got all the confidence in the world in them. 332 00:20:24,220 --> 00:20:28,980 Now, Bruce at that time had known Doc for a long time just like we all had and 333 00:20:28,980 --> 00:20:33,740 think kind of giggled. Sure, yeah, knock out Dr. Death. When they said that, it 334 00:20:33,740 --> 00:20:36,320 kind of made me feel like now they're already putting him with me now. 335 00:20:36,660 --> 00:20:38,960 Maybe they don't have any confidence in me and I'm just a nobody. 336 00:20:39,380 --> 00:20:41,480 Well, why wouldn't you have confidence in Dr. Death? 337 00:20:41,860 --> 00:20:42,859 Is that a sin? 338 00:20:42,860 --> 00:20:43,759 He was a... 339 00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:46,380 Four -time All -American in wrestling in Division I. 340 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:48,320 They don't give that stuff away. 341 00:20:48,860 --> 00:20:52,640 As soon as I walked in the door, Pat Patterson walked right up to me. He 342 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:55,240 oh, so you're going to knock out Dr. Death, are you? 343 00:20:55,630 --> 00:20:57,350 And at that time, I was just furious. 344 00:20:57,650 --> 00:21:02,090 It just pulled my blood because they nagged at me all day long. Oh, yeah, 345 00:21:02,090 --> 00:21:04,730 going to knock them out. You're going to knock them out. I go get something to 346 00:21:04,730 --> 00:21:08,630 eat or anywhere in the hall, somebody would have something smart out to say. 347 00:21:08,870 --> 00:21:13,470 They're all back there. They got their little clans and yakking. So just kept 348 00:21:13,470 --> 00:21:14,990 all bottled up all day long. 349 00:21:15,510 --> 00:21:19,710 When that match came on, it was standing room only at those monitors. 350 00:21:19,910 --> 00:21:23,150 It became very, very, very real. 351 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:28,060 As both men head to the ring, Dr. Death is the overwhelming favorite. 352 00:21:28,460 --> 00:21:32,020 At that time, I was so furious because of what everybody in the office was 353 00:21:32,020 --> 00:21:33,020 saying. 354 00:21:33,140 --> 00:21:36,660 And I was more tunnel vision. I wasn't seeing it any other way. I was going to 355 00:21:36,660 --> 00:21:37,660 go out and beat him. 356 00:21:38,020 --> 00:21:42,520 So they were toe -to -toe. Just thinking in my mind, okay, this is it. This is 357 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:43,520 what I'm going to have to do. 358 00:21:43,900 --> 00:21:46,800 The stakes are high in this matchup, and the brawl for all. 359 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:48,040 He took me down. 360 00:21:48,780 --> 00:21:50,580 I was kind of surprised at that. 361 00:21:51,420 --> 00:21:55,600 But then at some point, Bart switched up his game plan and took Doc down. 362 00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:56,800 Uh -oh. 363 00:21:58,500 --> 00:22:01,160 He was like halfway out of the ropes, and he's like, damn, brother. 364 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,700 And then I just said, sorry, what do you want me to do with the shoot? 365 00:22:04,900 --> 00:22:06,420 It's not like we're out there working. 366 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:14,160 Then at some point, Doc tore his hamstring. And now suddenly, Dr. Dusty 367 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:18,400 Williams has become a 300 -pound one -legged man in an ass -kicking contest 368 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:19,600 where you need to be mobile. 369 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,780 You know, right there at the end, I caught him a couple times. He was 370 00:22:23,780 --> 00:22:27,320 staggering. And I thought, man, he's fixing to go down. 371 00:22:27,900 --> 00:22:29,600 And then it happened. Boom, boom, boom. 372 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:35,540 And down goes Doc. 373 00:22:35,980 --> 00:22:37,320 He's out, cold. 374 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:38,820 And I was like, oh, shit. 375 00:22:40,140 --> 00:22:44,460 And my heart sunk. And I got a bad feeling in my stomach because I knew 376 00:22:44,460 --> 00:22:46,280 went Dr. Death's WWF career. 377 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:52,050 Dr. Death's injuries are so severe, He's forced to undergo a lengthy 378 00:22:52,050 --> 00:22:56,310 rehabilitation, but the damage to his reputation proves far worse. 379 00:22:56,650 --> 00:23:00,350 Within a year, he'd be out of the WWF entirely. 380 00:23:00,750 --> 00:23:02,810 There comes Russo walking down the hallway. 381 00:23:03,030 --> 00:23:04,030 I said, are you happy? 382 00:23:04,210 --> 00:23:09,050 You just cost the company $5 million in one night. And he looked at me and went, 383 00:23:09,130 --> 00:23:10,830 what are you talking about? I said, you idiot. 384 00:23:11,150 --> 00:23:15,690 Dr. Steve Williams just got beat on live television in front of everybody. 385 00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,800 What difference does it make how Bart Gunn's going to be a star now? 386 00:23:19,020 --> 00:23:20,020 I said, I want to kill you. 387 00:23:20,500 --> 00:23:24,060 I would like to just squeeze you until your britches are full and your eyeballs 388 00:23:24,060 --> 00:23:25,060 pop out. 389 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:29,940 Dr. Death, I'm sure we could have done a lot with him, but it's not like he was 390 00:23:29,940 --> 00:23:34,320 coming in at his peak or his prime or on his way up. It's probably fair to say 391 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:38,840 his best years in wrestling were behind him, but no doubt about it, you know, 392 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:41,380 that injury definitely cut his career short. 393 00:23:42,740 --> 00:23:44,260 Kind of quiet when I went back. 394 00:23:44,980 --> 00:23:49,840 Management didn't say anything to me. I had all the heat on me then, because I 395 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:51,120 just knocked out JR's boy. 396 00:23:51,900 --> 00:23:55,720 This whole Dr. Death element in the Brawl for All has been so grossly 397 00:23:55,720 --> 00:24:00,140 overthought that it has embarrassed me about some of my peers and some of my 398 00:24:00,140 --> 00:24:04,000 friends that actually believe there's another story. There's this covert 399 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,140 that's going on. We'll never really know the answer. 400 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:08,000 Come on. 401 00:24:08,220 --> 00:24:09,220 Grow up. 402 00:24:11,120 --> 00:24:13,320 I didn't really see anybody from the office after that. 403 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:17,380 So it's kind of like, you know, you guys were picking at me, and, you know, I 404 00:24:17,380 --> 00:24:18,380 did what I was going to do. 405 00:24:19,420 --> 00:24:23,080 Bart secures his place in the semifinals where the godfather awaits. 406 00:24:24,100 --> 00:24:27,540 In the other match, Draws takes on Bradshaw. 407 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:31,640 Oh, 408 00:24:33,120 --> 00:24:34,940 yeah. 409 00:24:41,129 --> 00:24:43,890 Absolutely. Well, I'm sure I reminded him a couple times. 410 00:24:44,150 --> 00:24:46,930 Should have gotten freaking points for a takedown there. 411 00:24:47,650 --> 00:24:51,930 That was a takedown under any rule, screwy or not. That was a takedown. How 412 00:24:51,930 --> 00:24:55,110 would you call this one, JR? Who do you think? What's close? Very close in my 413 00:24:55,110 --> 00:24:57,630 book. I'm on Draw's side here. 414 00:24:58,050 --> 00:25:00,290 Here's your winner, Rachel. 415 00:25:00,750 --> 00:25:01,369 There it is. 416 00:25:01,370 --> 00:25:03,170 Boo. I cried bullshit. 417 00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:05,880 Now I'm going to be bitter for the next couple days. 418 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:10,480 You guys are going to be bitter. I got tears in my eyes. I'm, like, fired up, 419 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:11,520 like, shit. 420 00:25:12,780 --> 00:25:18,300 And I had me wondering, of course, I don't know if the people upstairs, if 421 00:25:18,300 --> 00:25:22,800 wanted me to fight Bart at the time, and I still think that it was, you know, 422 00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:27,220 that I won the fight. But Bradshaw didn't go around bragging because he 423 00:25:27,620 --> 00:25:30,620 I so badly wanted Bradshaw to get his ass kicked. 424 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:35,580 That's all I cared about because he was so cocky. He was so confident when he 425 00:25:35,580 --> 00:25:40,220 made the remark. He couldn't back out of it now because I would be the first one 426 00:25:40,220 --> 00:25:44,420 to say, wait a minute, whoa, I just wanted him to get his clock clean. I'm 427 00:25:44,420 --> 00:25:49,900 honest. With only one fight left before the final, it's up to Bart Gunn or the 428 00:25:49,900 --> 00:25:53,360 Godfather to keep Bradshaw from having the last word. 429 00:26:00,260 --> 00:26:04,920 Working at this club right here in the 90s, and I was the manager from 5 o 430 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:09,800 'clock in the morning to 1 in the afternoon, and I hated pimps. And I 431 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:15,080 if there's any pimps behind this bar, they better not be here in the next five 432 00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,760 minutes because I will knock you off your bar stool. 433 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:22,240 And I swear to you, I would walk behind the bar, the pimp was sitting there just 434 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:26,120 cracking me as hard as I could, and they'd start running. But yeah, man. 435 00:26:26,570 --> 00:26:30,010 I used to be able to knock people out by slapping them in their face. 436 00:26:30,630 --> 00:26:35,230 The Godfather's second round victory over Too Cold Scorpio advances him to 437 00:26:35,230 --> 00:26:36,049 final four. 438 00:26:36,050 --> 00:26:40,050 He's just two wins away from claiming the $75 ,000 prize. 439 00:26:40,850 --> 00:26:44,990 Standing in his way is tournament underdog Bart Gunn. 440 00:26:45,230 --> 00:26:49,250 Well, this is going to be a tough fight. It's big, but I'm watching him like 441 00:26:49,250 --> 00:26:50,250 shadow boxing stuff. 442 00:26:50,590 --> 00:26:52,670 I go, wow, he's got boxing skills. 443 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,660 I went into that fight way overconfident. 444 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,940 I'd been smoking all day, yeah, but I smoke all day, all the time. 445 00:27:00,420 --> 00:27:03,700 Just before I fought Bart, he says, I'm going to knock you out. 446 00:27:04,100 --> 00:27:06,660 And I'm like, yeah, okay, good luck. 447 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,480 Do you remember anything of what you were thinking before going into that 448 00:27:10,780 --> 00:27:11,419 Get him. 449 00:27:11,420 --> 00:27:12,440 Don't let him take me down. 450 00:27:12,900 --> 00:27:14,320 Don't cold face, okay? 451 00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:17,140 I get myself up, come out throwing leathers. 452 00:27:17,420 --> 00:27:19,460 And here we go. This is going to be a slugfest, JR. 453 00:27:20,140 --> 00:27:22,140 You know, we were punching. I think he kind of caught me. 454 00:27:22,700 --> 00:27:23,700 Pretty good. 455 00:27:23,860 --> 00:27:25,920 I think, oh, that kind of stung a little bit. 456 00:27:26,340 --> 00:27:31,060 And somewhere in there, he hit me with something that knocked me to the ground. 457 00:27:31,300 --> 00:27:36,120 And I remember going back to the corner saying, I don't have my legs. I don't 458 00:27:36,120 --> 00:27:38,180 have my legs. I don't have my legs. 459 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:43,820 Every single person was at the monitor, and nobody could believe it. 460 00:27:53,420 --> 00:27:57,540 His head hit the ropes, her come real close to it, kind of went out of the 461 00:27:57,540 --> 00:28:00,420 and kind of hang in there. Like, wow, I hope he's okay. 462 00:28:00,940 --> 00:28:05,760 I mean, the reputation of the godfather and, you know, Bart being under the 463 00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,540 radar, I mean, unbelievable. 464 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:15,080 My wife was really upset because she was counting on that money. She was not 465 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:17,540 happy about it. She blamed it on me smoking. 466 00:28:17,740 --> 00:28:18,740 And I'm like, eh. 467 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:21,880 I didn't give Bart the amount of respect that I should have. 468 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:29,560 This is a few days after that fight. I was f***ed up. And I couldn't walk. 469 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:30,780 I had to get in a wheelchair. 470 00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:32,540 My leg got infected. 471 00:28:32,980 --> 00:28:35,720 I got this cut out. Oh, whoo. 472 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,220 Maybe that was the stupidest idea in wrestling right there. 473 00:28:39,580 --> 00:28:41,540 Because a lot of people did get hurt. 474 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:43,420 The injuries were a big, big deal. 475 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,640 Here's what it meant. It meant taking guys off the line. They were sitting at 476 00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:48,340 home. They couldn't work. They couldn't earn. 477 00:28:48,860 --> 00:28:51,400 And that cost the company money because they weren't able to be productive. 478 00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:52,660 It wasn't a good thing. 479 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:58,840 How morally and intellectually bankrupt and irresponsible do you have to be to 480 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:04,500 create a situation where your stars get legitimately injured just to get even 481 00:29:04,500 --> 00:29:08,160 with a wrestler who was bragging about how tough he was in the locker room? 482 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:12,060 He can't be feeling good about getting in the ring with Bart, man. There's no 483 00:29:12,060 --> 00:29:16,360 way. At that point, that was like the finals. There was only one more left, 484 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:17,360 that was Bradshaw. 485 00:29:17,630 --> 00:29:22,830 After a rollercoaster two months of combat, the Brawl for All final is set. 486 00:29:22,830 --> 00:29:26,350 one -time long shot against the man who inspired it all. 487 00:29:27,950 --> 00:29:31,150 Both men are trained very diligently for this contest. 488 00:29:31,470 --> 00:29:36,170 Come out, just a couple punches, caught him. There he goes! 489 00:29:37,050 --> 00:29:38,050 Unbelievable! 490 00:29:39,170 --> 00:29:41,650 Golly! It's like, wow, it's over. 491 00:29:42,190 --> 00:29:44,470 Then he got back up. I was like, whew. You okay? 492 00:29:44,890 --> 00:29:45,890 Let's go. 493 00:29:46,110 --> 00:29:48,790 Well, this may not last much longer. Oh, there it is. 494 00:29:49,130 --> 00:29:50,410 Oh, my God. 495 00:29:52,250 --> 00:29:53,250 Whoa. 496 00:29:53,950 --> 00:29:55,110 There's your winner. 497 00:29:56,790 --> 00:30:03,070 Take a look at a guy that has just made a name for himself in this business. 498 00:30:03,270 --> 00:30:04,270 Oh, 499 00:30:04,430 --> 00:30:05,670 my good night. 500 00:30:06,850 --> 00:30:10,010 Man, he even had the jittery legs. Did you see the jumpy legs? 501 00:30:10,590 --> 00:30:13,850 The smelling salt ain't doing nothing to him. 502 00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:19,420 When Bradshaw got knocked out, it was scary because his eyes obviously weren't 503 00:30:19,420 --> 00:30:23,260 there and he twitched a little bit and you could tell he wasn't home even a 504 00:30:23,260 --> 00:30:24,260 while afterwards. 505 00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:29,020 When I saw Bradshaw get knocked out, I could not hold back those emotions. 506 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:35,260 I'm sorry. This whole tournament was because of him and his mouth and there 507 00:30:35,260 --> 00:30:37,120 was laying on the canvas unconscious. 508 00:30:38,100 --> 00:30:43,380 Bro, you know the old saying, don't, don't, never, never ask for, how's that 509 00:30:44,060 --> 00:30:48,960 You get what you asked for, or you know what I mean. He didn't understand even 510 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:50,620 then what he had done to this day. 511 00:30:50,820 --> 00:30:53,440 The moron doesn't understand what he's done. 512 00:30:53,700 --> 00:30:59,200 I believe he sabotaged the talent, the integrity of the business, got people 513 00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:04,200 legitimately hurt, and killed a future superstar, and doesn't realize he did 514 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:05,200 anything wrong. 515 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:11,420 There, in a nutshell, you have the skid mark on the underwear of life that is 516 00:31:11,420 --> 00:31:12,980 Vince Russo. 517 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:20,560 I'm 57 years old. Jim Cornette is my age. When is this ever going to stop? 518 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:22,720 Cornette believed in the stake of the business. 519 00:31:22,940 --> 00:31:25,140 Russo more of the sizzle of the business. 520 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,700 and therein they have a tremendous controversy and conflict. 521 00:31:29,980 --> 00:31:33,100 They'll never be on the same page in my lifetime. 522 00:31:33,500 --> 00:31:40,280 Jim Cornette leaves a message on my answering machine, threatening to kill 523 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,840 threatening to kill my entire family. I said, I'd just like to tell you, you no 524 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:45,880 good piece of shit. 525 00:31:47,500 --> 00:31:51,080 What a piece of shit you are and how you narrowly escaped getting put in a 526 00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,980 hospital by me with a goddamn baseball bat for all you've done to me and my 527 00:31:54,980 --> 00:31:57,860 friends and the careers you've ruined and the shitty wrestling that you 528 00:31:57,860 --> 00:32:01,060 produced. I just wanted to make sure that you knew that from my own lips. 529 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:05,540 And I'm just like, bro, this is wrestling. Like, are you serious? 530 00:32:05,780 --> 00:32:10,680 Like, you're going to kill me over professional wrestling. Why is he doing 531 00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:12,360 to me? Just over wrestling? 532 00:32:12,580 --> 00:32:13,680 Just over wrestling? 533 00:32:14,380 --> 00:32:17,880 That's what it's always been because he just, I can't believe that he would do 534 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:19,200 this to me just over wrestling. 535 00:32:19,700 --> 00:32:23,400 And wrestling has been the most important thing in my life. 536 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:32,000 With a disastrous brawl for all finally over, Bart Gunn has proven to be the 537 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:33,320 toughest guy in the locker room. 538 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:35,640 And he was ready to jumpstart his career. 539 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:38,600 But he was in for a brutal awakening. 540 00:32:46,179 --> 00:32:49,700 Well, these here are the gloves that they gave me for winning the Brawl for 541 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:54,360 It is my privilege and honor to present you with these golden boxing gloves. 542 00:32:54,860 --> 00:32:57,140 What was your reaction to winning this whole thing? 543 00:32:57,400 --> 00:32:58,139 It was great. 544 00:32:58,140 --> 00:33:00,180 I thought, man, I'm finally going to get a great push. 545 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:05,120 Jim Ross comes up, talks to me. He says, hey, to be honest, we didn't think 546 00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:06,680 anybody could take Steve off his feet. 547 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,340 He goes, I guess we should have did our homework on you a little better. 548 00:33:09,690 --> 00:33:13,650 And I said, well, probably so. You know, I tried to work with you guys, and he's 549 00:33:13,650 --> 00:33:16,010 like, well, I just want you to know there's no hard feelings. 550 00:33:16,270 --> 00:33:20,370 And I think as soon as he said that, I thought, wow, I do got some heat. 551 00:33:21,350 --> 00:33:25,410 After his victory in the Brawl for All, Bart Gunn is awaiting his big career 552 00:33:25,410 --> 00:33:31,830 push. The WWF are now faced with the problem of what to do with a wrestler 553 00:33:31,830 --> 00:33:33,330 didn't expect to win. 554 00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:37,280 It was always the plan that whoever would win the Brawl for All would get a 555 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:40,880 promotional push. When it was Bart, the wind kind of came out of those sails. 556 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,800 I'm not knocking Bart Gunn. Great athlete, good wrestler, good guy. 557 00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:49,960 But the way he had been presented for the previous five years was at a level 558 00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:51,140 here, not here. 559 00:33:51,580 --> 00:33:52,580 Examine the facts. 560 00:33:53,660 --> 00:33:55,520 Nobody got over. 561 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:59,620 Not one son of a bitch that fought in that Brawl for All got over. 562 00:33:59,860 --> 00:34:00,860 End of story. 563 00:34:01,700 --> 00:34:02,700 They sent me home. 564 00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:04,600 Now they don't know what to do with me. 565 00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:09,460 Vince Russo called me up, and he said, Boris, we don't really know what type of 566 00:34:09,460 --> 00:34:14,340 a storyline gimmick to put you in. I kind of sat home for a long time, not 567 00:34:14,340 --> 00:34:17,320 anything. The longer I sat at home, the more frustrating it was. 568 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,659 They let him twist in the wind for a little while, and then, of course, Vince 569 00:34:21,659 --> 00:34:23,500 McMahon got the idea because it's a gimmick. 570 00:34:23,739 --> 00:34:26,340 Butterbean! Let's let him fight Butterbean at WrestleMania. 571 00:34:30,380 --> 00:34:34,480 Well, my understanding is when Bart knocked out Dr. Death, Vince got pissed. 572 00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:36,600 So they called me in for his punishment. 573 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:40,739 Butterbean's an overachiever. You know, he's got that bald head and he's very 574 00:34:40,739 --> 00:34:42,980 white. He looks like some sort of appliance. 575 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:45,780 But boy, does he hit. Oh, my God. 576 00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:52,400 Eric Esch, a .k .a. Butterbean, is a 300 -pound professional prize fighter with 577 00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,420 more than 50 wins under his belt. 578 00:34:55,139 --> 00:34:56,639 What he lacked in technique. 579 00:34:57,190 --> 00:34:59,930 he more than makes up for with raw hitting power. 580 00:35:00,690 --> 00:35:05,710 So at some point it was suggested Butterbean and Bart have a boxing match 581 00:35:05,710 --> 00:35:09,310 because Butterbean was a great personality, great for wrestling. 582 00:35:09,610 --> 00:35:14,010 I think it was presented to me, and, you know, I was like, ah, you know, I 583 00:35:14,010 --> 00:35:15,810 don't, you know, sure, I guess. 584 00:35:16,070 --> 00:35:18,510 You know, because I was sitting at home, I was tired of sitting at home. And 585 00:35:18,510 --> 00:35:21,690 they said, hey, we're going to send you to a boxing school, you know, and they 586 00:35:21,690 --> 00:35:22,910 start teaching me how to box. 587 00:35:23,530 --> 00:35:27,330 The crossover match serves as both the promotional push Bart has been waiting 588 00:35:27,330 --> 00:35:33,350 for and a chance for the WWF to cash in on Butterbean's mainstream popularity. 589 00:35:33,710 --> 00:35:38,750 The man that will face Butterbean, Bart Gunn. Well, JR, you know, I'm not 590 00:35:38,750 --> 00:35:41,450 training just to beat him. I'm training to knock him out. 591 00:35:42,660 --> 00:35:46,800 Me, Butterbean, and Gilbert, we were chilling. I think me and Gil were 592 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,740 Butterbean wasn't smoking. And we were talking about it. 593 00:35:50,060 --> 00:35:53,180 Butterbean, he told me, he said this, and I've already told Vince. 594 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,260 He goes, you guys are tough guys. I give you that, okay? 595 00:35:56,500 --> 00:35:58,780 But you're not professional fighters. 596 00:35:59,220 --> 00:36:01,180 I will beat that kid in seconds. 597 00:36:01,930 --> 00:36:06,330 It's two different sports. He had no chance against me. You know, Vince kind 598 00:36:06,330 --> 00:36:10,130 smiled at me when I went to the ring. He knew that it was over for Bart. He knew 599 00:36:10,130 --> 00:36:12,770 that I was going to knock him out, and he wanted me to knock him out. 600 00:36:13,330 --> 00:36:17,050 Walking into WrestleMania was kind of like no experience I've ever had up to 601 00:36:17,050 --> 00:36:18,850 that point. This place was huge. 602 00:36:19,350 --> 00:36:26,130 On March 28, 1999, the WWF resurrects the Brawl for All concept on their 603 00:36:26,130 --> 00:36:28,410 largest stage, WrestleMania XV. 604 00:36:29,150 --> 00:36:33,550 A talented amateur can't stand up next to a professional in any field. So there 605 00:36:33,550 --> 00:36:37,950 was no reason to believe that even though Bart was a great -looking athlete 606 00:36:37,950 --> 00:36:41,790 Butterbean was a big, fat, round, baked potato with arms and legs, Butterbean 607 00:36:41,790 --> 00:36:44,990 was a trained and experienced professional boxer. 608 00:36:45,870 --> 00:36:49,530 I didn't feel the same as I felt with the other fights because I'm different 609 00:36:49,530 --> 00:36:53,030 now. I'm a boxer now, and I got this other persona. 610 00:36:53,630 --> 00:36:55,870 Here we go, round one, brawl for all. 611 00:36:56,090 --> 00:36:57,190 Butterbean and Bart Gunn. 612 00:36:57,550 --> 00:36:59,290 I remember being in the crowd. 613 00:36:59,590 --> 00:37:00,810 Something was off. 614 00:37:01,110 --> 00:37:05,950 This wasn't the guy that I saw knock out the Godfather and the guy that I saw 615 00:37:05,950 --> 00:37:09,370 knock out Bradshaw. This wasn't one of those fights. 616 00:37:09,710 --> 00:37:13,570 Now I'm out there as a green boxer trying to, okay, hold my hands like 617 00:37:13,630 --> 00:37:14,630 hold my feet like this. 618 00:37:14,910 --> 00:37:18,430 When Bart tried to box, I said, this is it. I got him now, so I just went in, 619 00:37:18,450 --> 00:37:20,950 charged him, just give him a couple good shots, put him to the mat. 620 00:37:21,170 --> 00:37:23,850 And then when I went to the corner, I'm like, man, I hope he don't get up 621 00:37:23,850 --> 00:37:26,850 because it's going to be bad if he does because he's wobbling. 622 00:37:27,390 --> 00:37:30,710 When Vinny let the fight go on, I'm going, hey, you don't need to do that. 623 00:37:30,710 --> 00:37:33,290 out of it. So I just give him one last good right hand. 624 00:37:35,230 --> 00:37:38,710 His head actually turned around backwards. 625 00:37:39,550 --> 00:37:42,070 Yeah, you know, when I got home, my kids come home from school, and they were a 626 00:37:42,070 --> 00:37:47,090 little upset. They go, Dad, my friend told me you killed a guy on TV. You 627 00:37:47,090 --> 00:37:48,049 Bart Gunn. 628 00:37:48,050 --> 00:37:50,290 I said, he's not dead. He just looked like it. 629 00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:55,480 I'll be honest, if he had a 50 -50 chance, if he went out and brawled like 630 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:56,480 did with the other guys. 631 00:37:56,740 --> 00:37:59,580 But with me, he actually tried to box, which was stupid. 632 00:37:59,940 --> 00:38:02,320 Very disappointed, very, very mad at myself. 633 00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:05,960 You know, just wasn't happy at all. 634 00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:10,820 After WrestleMania, I knew I was done. There wasn't a future left there for me 635 00:38:10,820 --> 00:38:11,820 at all. 636 00:38:11,860 --> 00:38:14,320 The end. That was the end there for me in the States. 637 00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:23,860 A lot of old stuff here. 638 00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:26,920 You said you hadn't watched the Butterbean fight. 639 00:38:27,140 --> 00:38:29,020 Can you talk about why that was the case? 640 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:35,720 I don't know if I want that on air, but... I 641 00:38:35,720 --> 00:38:40,880 just never watched it. I was mad at myself that I made some mistakes. 642 00:38:41,630 --> 00:38:45,650 But it always stuck in the back of my mind. And then I saw, when I was in 643 00:38:45,910 --> 00:38:48,030 Butterbean. I saw he was over there. He's doing MMA. 644 00:38:48,370 --> 00:38:49,950 I thought, wow, this is interesting. 645 00:38:50,230 --> 00:38:52,130 Because I always wanted to get a second chance. 646 00:38:52,390 --> 00:38:54,250 And I said, you know, I'm going to do MMA. 647 00:38:55,230 --> 00:38:58,130 And I got a fight with Wesley Cabbage. 648 00:38:58,450 --> 00:38:59,970 And Butterbean fought him. 649 00:39:00,670 --> 00:39:04,590 Butterbean beat him, I think, in the second or third round. Went over there. 650 00:39:04,590 --> 00:39:08,310 very first MMA fight and stopped it in the first round. So I said, yeah, I beat 651 00:39:08,310 --> 00:39:09,990 this guy quicker than Butterbean beat him. 652 00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:13,560 One night, like on a Tuesday night, I said, hey, we got you a match with 653 00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:14,920 Butterbean. So really great. 654 00:39:15,220 --> 00:39:17,020 Yeah, we want you to come fight Friday. 655 00:39:17,540 --> 00:39:18,540 It's like in four days. 656 00:39:18,620 --> 00:39:19,740 And I said, no, no, no, no, no. 657 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:21,260 I've learned from my mistakes. 658 00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:24,460 You can't even set up a match with me and Butterbean. I went 12 weeks to train 659 00:39:24,460 --> 00:39:26,140 for it. So that didn't happen. 660 00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:28,360 Could have turned out the same thing. Could have beat me again. 661 00:39:28,820 --> 00:39:31,940 But I would have got to do it a little bit better my way. 662 00:39:32,330 --> 00:39:35,610 It may sound crazy to a lot of people, but that's just kind of the way I'm 663 00:39:35,610 --> 00:39:40,070 driven. And then kind of time passed, and then sad things happened in my life. 664 00:39:40,110 --> 00:39:43,070 And after that, I was kind of done with the whole fighting thing, and then I 665 00:39:43,070 --> 00:39:44,070 didn't do any more. 666 00:39:44,410 --> 00:39:48,290 I miss being at the curtain and going through the curtain and out and 667 00:39:48,290 --> 00:39:52,070 performing. You know, you got the excitement in the crowd, the adrenaline 668 00:39:52,330 --> 00:39:55,330 Me going to work every day, there's not adrenaline rush there anymore. 669 00:39:55,590 --> 00:39:59,210 But I enjoy sleeping in my bed every night, you know, sitting there with my 670 00:39:59,210 --> 00:40:00,210 dinner at the house. 671 00:40:00,310 --> 00:40:01,430 You get tired of it. 672 00:40:01,690 --> 00:40:04,830 eating out all your meals, you know, seven days a week. 673 00:40:05,750 --> 00:40:12,690 So... Droz's career in the WWF would continue 674 00:40:12,690 --> 00:40:17,050 for another year until a tragic accident changed his life forever. 675 00:40:17,990 --> 00:40:21,190 Do you mind if I ask you a few questions about your injury? No problem, man. 676 00:40:21,250 --> 00:40:24,900 Okay. Prior to it happening, what was your plan for the wrestling business? 677 00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:26,840 You know, I really had no clue. 678 00:40:27,100 --> 00:40:30,560 And the funny part is I was actually going to win that match. 679 00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,280 You know, I didn't get a lot of wins. 680 00:40:32,700 --> 00:40:37,160 Droz was wrestling D 'Lo Brown one night. And D 'Lo was a very smooth, 681 00:40:37,260 --> 00:40:38,260 accomplished wrestler. 682 00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:42,620 We were just going to do a powerbomb. And he had powerbombed me before. 683 00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:46,240 When he picked me up, I don't know if I slipped or what. 684 00:40:46,900 --> 00:40:50,940 I have this, these memories are seared in my brain perfectly. 685 00:40:52,150 --> 00:40:53,150 Which stinks. 686 00:40:54,310 --> 00:40:56,330 Pulled him up and we didn't go. 687 00:40:56,850 --> 00:40:58,150 And we just fell forward. 688 00:40:58,510 --> 00:41:01,970 But I remember going back down like this isn't right. I couldn't get my hands 689 00:41:01,970 --> 00:41:02,769 down really. 690 00:41:02,770 --> 00:41:04,730 And I just remember hearing crack, crack. 691 00:41:05,230 --> 00:41:07,650 And I just went, oh, I just broke my neck. 692 00:41:08,070 --> 00:41:10,090 I said, stop messing with me. You okay? 693 00:41:10,990 --> 00:41:11,990 Can't move. 694 00:41:14,390 --> 00:41:17,870 One of the cardinal rules is you're supposed to leave the ring the same way 695 00:41:17,870 --> 00:41:18,870 went into it. 696 00:41:19,020 --> 00:41:22,000 And I remember crying next to him, telling him, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm 697 00:41:22,060 --> 00:41:23,038 it should never happen. 698 00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:25,580 I was going, it's okay, dog, it's okay, it's okay, it's okay. 699 00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,480 Nothing we could have done would have changed, you know, it just happens. 700 00:41:29,980 --> 00:41:34,900 So, but he's a good guy, man. I still wish, I wish him the best last time I 701 00:41:34,900 --> 00:41:38,200 him. Neither of us, we've talked about it, we don't know what happened. 702 00:41:39,060 --> 00:41:40,240 Neither of us blame the other. 703 00:41:40,860 --> 00:41:42,700 It's one of those unfortunate accidents that happen. 704 00:41:44,020 --> 00:41:47,960 Bottom line is I'm here, still alive, I'm still kicking. Well, not kicking 705 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,020 really, but I can't kick. 706 00:41:50,260 --> 00:41:51,900 But I still get to go out and I hunt. 707 00:41:52,140 --> 00:41:56,320 You know, I do all the things that I can do. It's just, you know, you learn to 708 00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:57,320 do things differently. 709 00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:00,860 Draw is still paralyzed to this day. It's been more than 20 years. 710 00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:04,480 Things happen, you know, in this business. 711 00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:11,940 And it's not ballet. And that's why it especially angers me when people 712 00:42:11,940 --> 00:42:13,100 it one move. 713 00:42:13,660 --> 00:42:15,580 He's been in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. 714 00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:18,560 So don't tell me that wrestling is a bunch of bullshit. 715 00:42:18,820 --> 00:42:23,120 Just some of the ways that people that have gotten into it treat it is 716 00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:27,060 I feel bad. 717 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:31,520 How come? Because I don't want to see anybody get hit like that, man. Oh, my 718 00:42:31,520 --> 00:42:32,520 God. 719 00:42:32,700 --> 00:42:36,540 Especially now with just all the stuff we know about head trauma and 720 00:42:36,760 --> 00:42:37,760 man. 721 00:42:38,580 --> 00:42:39,920 Oh, man. 722 00:42:45,540 --> 00:42:49,780 I really should have been thinking, man, these guys are out of their element 723 00:42:49,780 --> 00:42:54,760 with what we know about concussions today. Just knowing all that today, 724 00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:59,180 didn't know back then, no way, no way would I ever propose it again. 725 00:42:59,700 --> 00:43:02,400 I think the brawl should be remembered for what it was, a cluster. 726 00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:03,960 It sucked. 727 00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,280 There's no reason to embrace it. 728 00:43:07,850 --> 00:43:12,470 It was simply a bad idea that featured a lot of guys looking to get a rub in a 729 00:43:12,470 --> 00:43:14,410 new event. That's what it was developed to do. 730 00:43:14,850 --> 00:43:20,690 Create some new stars, new rubs, new opportunities. And it just didn't do it. 731 00:43:21,430 --> 00:43:25,490 The Brawl for All remains the only prize -fighting tournament to be put on by 732 00:43:25,490 --> 00:43:26,490 the WWE. 733 00:43:26,990 --> 00:43:31,770 What could have been a career -defining moment for its champion instead became a 734 00:43:31,770 --> 00:43:36,290 stark reminder of how wrestling's winners are always chosen in the 735 00:43:37,259 --> 00:43:41,360 Bruce has said that the Brawl for All is the, quote, absolute worst idea in the 736 00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:42,360 history of the business. 737 00:43:43,060 --> 00:43:45,880 I agree with that, but they're the ones that put it on. 738 00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:50,500 So explain that one. 739 00:43:51,660 --> 00:43:55,580 I think they should learn from their mistakes and probably should never do it 740 00:43:55,580 --> 00:43:56,580 again. 741 00:43:56,700 --> 00:43:58,680 Should just kind of let it disappear.